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Who Hijacked Reality / #563 Why do we only act on the precipice of events?

Wednesday, September 14th, 2011

 

 

Journal Entry #563

September 14th, 2011

From the movie “The Day the Earth Stood Still”;

“It’s only on the brink that people find the will to change only at the precipice do we evolve”.

httpv://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qb3CzkK_ew

Behind the Scenes on the Movie: The Day The Earth Stood Still

Are we just plain lazy or stupid if we can see problems before they arise and do nothing about them? Will this be our downfall? Is it arrogant to think we can continue on doing what we do without any consequences?  Is this human trait unavoidable or can we change?

I’m no different than anyone else I do these things as well, procrastinate, make unhealthy choices knowing full well the consequences but still doing it anyways and then like many others beating myself up for those poor choices when  the consequences are evident. So we obviously need to evolve to be proactive in our choices but the thing that gets me is that we have an incredibly hard time learning from our past mistakes as we keep repeating them and fooling ourselves that we are not.

I see some key traits that we must change as a species in order to evolve.

We must learn to stop being so self absorbed.

We must learn to agree.

We must learn to value and acknowledge the truth and reality.

We must stop lying to ourselves which in turn will stop us lying to others.

We must learn to listen not just hear and value those who have more knowledge and insight than the rest.

We must chose our leaders based on better criteria.

We must learn to live for the future while living in the moment.

We must stop dividing and start uniting while maintaining both our individuality and diversity.

We must be proactive not reactive.

We are an intelligent species but I do believe we think we are more intelligent than we are. Instead of having awe and wonder for the natural world, the planet that sustains us and all this encompasses we think we can actually control it and shape it to our will. This is an illusion. We need to humble ourselves or the planet will do it for us. It may very well be too late already.

Solutions to our problems are at hand and yet we just won’t listen. Were like a bunch of 15 years olds trying to get attention in high school.

Seek the truth always

Gary David Currie

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Who Hijacked Reality / #552 If you are going to identify as a scientist at least know the basics of science

Saturday, September 3rd, 2011

 

 

  Journal Entry #552

September 3rd, 2011

 

I am not a scientist but I at least know the basics if not more so when a person who professes faith declares themselves a scientist I would expect this. The problem when you try and defend your faith with science is that it does not work and you will be practising bad science. This person as I have seen from others has drawn their conclusion of Creation and then tried to fit the chosen evidence in to support it and it doesn’t work that way.

When I heard these types of comments during a discussion I know we are done as this person is either lying by saying they are a scientist or they are practising bad science;

Comments from a Christian, I will post the entire discussion to give it context. I offered plenty of evidence and openings for this person to offer some verifiable evidence. I directed him to credible evidence from credible scientists and still he ignored what as a scientist should be obvious.

I ask that you stay with the conversation as it will be worth it but I always want to present things in context so as not to be accused of quote mining.

-For one evolution is a belief system and not science at all. I am a scientist and I cannot accept it at all.

-But theory and hypothesis is the same and no one has done research on evolution, it was put forward. There is no place it has ever been tested and proved. Unless you do not know what and how research is done.

THE DISCUSSION;

Anna Hazare’s formula for a life that can influence others…

1. Clean words

2. Clean Actions

3. Spotless Character

4. Willingness to take blames

… 5. Sacrifice

Christian……Only ingredient missing is faith in Christ then it would be sweet

Gary David Currie…… Interesting list but I think the most important ideal is missing.

Always acknowledge the truth and how we determine it. Faith in Christ should not even be considered for the list as it has not been confirmed as true.

Christian #2….Hi Gary, after a long time. How u doing? Well, what u say is a point of discussion. What I mean is, its not faith in Christ that is the point of discussion, but your claim that it is ‘not confirmed’ is the point of discussion. Questionable statement.

Christian #3……..Very good question for discussion.

Christian….oh yes. probably Gary is saying it is difficult to know and confirm whether one has faith in Christ. Is it Gary?

Gary David Currie……. that is a great question.. A few thing must be defined first.

What faith is, The meaning of Christ. If we are to follow Gandhi’s example he said truth is the highest ideal one should aspire to.

Christian #1…………meaning of Christ is wrong proposition, Christ is not just word, Christ is Person. Truth about Christ is meaningful. That makes Faith tangible.

Gary David Currie.. I disagree  as Christ will mean many different things to many different people. You are right Christ is more than a word it is also a concept that many have adopted in their life’s to guide them but when you say the truth about Christ is meaningful what does that mean.

Before you can say that faith is tangible you must define faith as based on the definition I use it is not tangible.

Christian……… mmm, good discussion, i think it depends from which angle ones looks at it. is philosophical( I mean raw philosophy where everything has no locus standi) or is it biblical. From biblical point truth and Jesus are the same. Christ can only mean the anointed son of God who came in flesh and died on a cross and rose the third day, he lives in us through the Holy Spirit, he speaks to us and direct us( by us i mean those who have been converted, the disciples of Christ). But philosophical question such as raised by Gary, may be from the context of pluralistic society and pantheism where you can pick any body and make him/it your god can be difficult. Faith is also , in biblical context is just trust, confidence in God or Jesus.

Gary David Currie…. Interesting  but I think you are missing a huge problem when you use a biblical argument and I will post one of my articles to demonstrate… You see the main core of any structure should be truth and religion as a basis for truth in my opinion fails every time.

http://thefreeman.net/journal/?p=5447  Who Hijacked Reality / #547 Creating your own religion, it happens all the time.

You see if one beliefs that god is real then things like pantheism also become legitimate when the evidence tells us that these are al l just manmade concepts. I chose the angle of truth to look at this otherwise we are lost in speculation.

 

The actual meaning of faith is to believe something to be true without any evidence and this does not happen in religion or with god as it is selected evidence that is used to determine the belief.

If there is one thing that is consistent even though many will tell me I am wrong within those that are believers is that they just can’t seem to come to a consensus of what they believe.

Gary David Currie….. I would certainly challenge your statement the truth and Jesus are the same.

Here is where the fun begins…………………………….

Christian…..The problem with your view Gary is that it is anti-religion. The basis of faith for me is not what you define it to be. Faith cannot believe something without evidence, which would not be Christian faith. And at no point can one create his or her religion, unless it is cult as we know it. Basic questions first, how did you come to exist? How did human beings and the world come to be?

Gary David Currie…… There is no problem there is only what is true and my view is not anti religion that is a ridiculous thing to say I am pro truth.. I acknowledge what is real and verifiable not what I believe to be true. You do not have faith you have a belief which is based on evidence all be it bad evidence as far as the testing methods go for determining truth. Of course one can create a religion it happens all the time as each person interprets things differently I offered you proof of this right in the article to deny this is silly. also that is why like I said there are 38,000 registered denominations of Christianity alone so did these people who started each denomination not create their own version of their god? Of course they did.

 Christian faith is always defined by each Christian as the correct faith and yet there are so many versions of this faith. Look up what the word religion actually means as there are several definitions.

 

Basic question #1; my mother and father conceived me.

 

Second question; Answer human beings through evolution, the world through the evolution of the universe. This is a fact not a speculation.

 

What you really mean is called the first cause argument

And it is a terrible argument for god as now you must define and prove your god meaning a believers god is real. Also you will have to prove where go came from.

 

We don’t know what went bang and until we do it will be an unknown but one cannot insert their favourite answer here and say it is true unless they have incredible evidence to back it up. That is called the argument from ignorance

 

I really don’t want o go into these well refuted arguments for the existence of god.

 

I only acknowledge what is true as again I am all about the truth as all should be.

Christian……….ok, so on what ground do you say something is true? From your argument, nothing is really true. For one evolution is a belief system and not science at all. I am a scientist and i cannot accept it at all, unless you tell me about the assumptions made, explain the gaps as so on. It is not based on science, in other words, it requires faith to believe in evolution, and so create your god. Denomination in Christianity do not belief in different gods my dear, they just happen to do things differently but God is the same. If it is different god then it is called a cult. But tell me how you arrive at truth first and dismiss your evolution issue, it is based on faith, no prove has come forth.

Gary David Currie …….. . NO evolution is not a belief system this is simply something those of faith say to deny it. It is fact accepted by 99.87% of scientists in the world and to deny this is ignorance. I mean no offence but that is jus the way it is. If …you are a scientist and do not accept evolution you are denying the process of science. If I have to explain this to you when almost all of your colleagues in the world agree it is a fact then you really are missing the point of science.

 

You should know as a scientist that it is all based on probabilities and not absolutes.

You’re kidding right when you say there has been no proof put forth on evolution. You literally must be joking.

 

As a scientist if you deny evolution as a fact our conversation will be tainted if we talk about anything else. Here I will link an article I wrote to demonstrate how science works since you seem to be ignoring the process.

http://thefreeman.net/journal/?p=3257 Who Hijacked Reality / #323 I love the baloney detection kit. «

http://thefreeman.net/journal/?p=5269    Who Hijacked Reality / #527 Back to the basics, how do we determine what is true?

Ok this seems to be the fundamental problem that I see in humanity. I think the vast majority of people understand the process without acknowledging it but tend to ignore it when it should be used on something they want to believe to be true even though the method we use to determine truth verifies

Christian………Gary, Evolution is a theory; if you know science, they begin with a theory, which is belief, and then they test it. The probability comes from data, not from philosophy. So when you say 99% accept, when you did the research, if they do, they do base on their faith of denying the creation theory. Mind you they are both theory, one is meant to deny God exist and that is the one you love. If you have ever done research, you will know what I am talking about

Christian………Gary , I wonder whether you have done research , you will begin to understand what I am telling you. Those who want to ignore God, behave and conduct themselves the way you do. But if there is any iota of science in you, tell me, any research done to proof evolution

Gary David Currie ….. that is incorrect they do not begin with a theory they begin with a hypothesis. A theory in Science is a well established set of facts that support a conclusion. Evolution has been well tested over the last 160 years and has passed every time.

 

Creation does not even qualify as a theory it is biblical story telling with no evidence to support it. Where do you get these terms faith in deny creation that is just silly. One is not means to deny god it is has nothing to do with god only religious people have decided that. It is the explanation of our origins established through rigorous scientific testing. Look believe in creation if you want to but please don’t call it true as there is no evidence to support it.

 

I am not going to debate this topic with you as it is well established that evolution is a fact.

 

I have done plenty of research as verified by over 550 articles on my website as a start.

Gary David Currie….. I am not ignoring god again that is silly.. I just do not accept it as true as there is no good reason to, Look again evolution is well documented and proven, to deny it is just ignorance especially if you call yourself a scientist then you are practising bad science. Take offence if you want to. MY website has plenty of articles and supported evidence to verify this, besides any credible scientist accepts this as fact. I will take their word over any preacher any day.

httpv://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s47ArcQL-XQ

50 Renowned Academics Speaking About God

Christian………. Gary I take no offence, I think I understand where you are coming from. But theory and hypothesis is the same and no one has done research on evolution, it was put forward. There is no place it has ever been tested and proved. Unless you do not know what and how research is done. The levels of evidence range from 1-5, I think evolution may not be in any level at all because there is no expert here. Darwin was hypothesizing, which is similar to theory my friend. Do your backs check. Your website is full of hypothesis and theories with no proof at all and that is not acceptable.

Gary David Currie …. you have just said that 1,000′s of scientists have not done legitimate work in their field. I really do not have time to talk to people who deny fact especially if they call themselves scientists. All you are trying to do is ignore reality, enjoy yourself. You can still believe in your god while realizing that evolution is a fact. Creationism is a dying breed.

Evolution is the basis of so much science that again to deny this is insane.

Basic science for you …

http://physics.about.com/od/physics101thebasics/a/hypothesis.htm

Information on formulating a scientific hypothesis. Here you will also find discussions of models, theories, and laws, as well as the differences between them.

Gary David Currie …… Darwin was 160 years ago I think the theory has been well solidified since then.

Gary David Currie……

I’ll try one more time and if you truly are a scientist you will see that this is how science works;

https://www.facebook.com/libraryofevolution?ref=ts

https://www.facebook.com/libraryofevolution?ref=ts#!/notes/the-library-of-evolution/the-library-of-evolution/178638248876175

Delivering authentic and accurate information about the theory of evolution, presenting facts, refuting creationist arguments, clearing the common misconceptions about evolution and providing sources for further reading about the topic.

Christian………..it is difficult to get this going. But I pray your eyes will be open, 160 years cannot compare to 4000 years and above if number of years were important. your argument are not scientific at all, as such I , the fact that you have some 1000 …scientist doing shoddy job does not make it right and will never make it. What makes result right is the level of evidence used not the number of scientist thinking so. That is the lowest level

Gary David Currie………. Good luck with your beliefs. I aspire to acknowledge truth no matter what it is. You will have your own agenda which is of course your right. You can pray for me all you want to there are many that say they will and still the truth remains the same. I am sorry that you do not realize how science and reason works as you try and fit them into your beliefs. I work the other way around as I let the evidence speak, all the evidence.

Christian…………ok. I see you do not want to know truth , you have a fixed mind. I ask you again, how do you arrive at truth? from your view you must always research. I you agree with theory? How was the theory developed? How was data collected? how was it analyst?

Gary David Currie……  the truth is that we cannot talk as you simply deny what si actually true. If you have gone to my website you will plainly see how I arrive at truth. I am not going to debate evolution with you as this is well established as true unless you have some verifiable evidence to prove creation there is no point. Look I have talked with many and you are saying what all deniers of verifiable evidence say so my time is incredibly valuable and I am done wasting it here. Like I said good luck.

Science without the basics is bad science….

Seek the truth always

Gary David Currie

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Who Hijacked Reality / #499 If find it sad that we must challenge certain claims in life that should be obviously false.

Tuesday, July 12th, 2011

 

 

Journal Entry #499

July 12th, 2011

What a world we live in, always something to complain about, people hurting each other, people ignoring reality and people ignoring the plight of others. We are all trying to survive to live out our existence. So much misery, so much pain, so many unfulfilled, so many lost, so many searching and so many escaping. Maybe it’s just me but it appears that we seem to constantly bring hurt upon ourselves. Illusion fuelled living seems to be the order of the day.

How many of us mask the truth of how we see life, how we live our life’s?

Henry David Thoreau – Wikiquote

The sun is but a morning star. The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation.

It doesn’t have to be this way. Sure we all have problems that is how we accomplish things in life. We need challenges to rise to daily to avoid repetitive boredom but what I see is that we create so much of our own misery. I am applying this to the human race as to address each person’s individual situation would be a task I am not prepared for.

We continually lie to ourselves; we accept things that are blatantly not true. This makes no sense to me and can be considered a form of self abusive behaviour. There are plenty of lies we accept as true that lead to what I am describing but let’s focus on the big ones.

We are not lying to ourselves;

This is what I will label as the number one problem as we continually lie to ourselves by telling ourselves we are not lying to ourselves. This is evident in the daily events of human life. Reality is a place we continually try to avoid.

Gods, religion and other unverifiable belief systems;

This is the dominant lie of this modern world. Look all the arguments for the existence of gods or anything else of supernatural or unverifiable origin have been refuted over and over and yet the vast majority of humanity continually appeals to one delusion or another. The negative effects of these beliefs are a continual source of misery and pain evident in our daily discourse and activities we engage in as a species.

What we conceive in and worship as the gods of man are simply that the gods of man. When will humans finally acknowledge this as the main excuse and reason for so many of the problems we create towards each other?

We are selfish in everything we do;

I acknowledge this as I cannot change it. This is how the real world works and once one accepts this as reality the door opens for a better world for us all.  All I do, I do for me and this allows me to understand why I do the things I do.

If we do not learn from our mistakes we are doomed to repeat them over and over and we seem pretty good at doing this.

I have offered what I believe are very simple solutions that start with each individual. I call it “ The Code”

http://thefreeman.net/journal/?p=4412  Who Hijacked Reality / #436 “The Code” reintroduced

http://thefreeman.net/journal/?p=4088  Who Hijacked Reality / #405 Introduction of my book for feedback..

If you scan through my blog posts there is enough information there to give you a solid idea of what I am presenting. I am an advocate of the truth, not what we want to be true. I am all for discussing ideas and issues but we keep hashing over the same old nonsense on many issues that have been thoroughly refuted.

I will keep talking about these belief systems and keep challenging them as I see this as the discussion that must take place. I think it is incredibly sad that it is the focus of humanity but that is my problem not yours. I guess it boils down to this; if people are  not listening, are not willing to accept reality or to even attempt to define it, to focus  on what is actually true then what hope to do we have in overcoming the problems we create? I do believe that hope rests with those willing to speak out against these claims and the damage they leave in their wake.

If you do not value evidence then what possible evidence can I give you?

If you do not value logic then what possible logic can I use?

If you do not value reason then what reason will you accept?
What is left for you to actually value?

It cannot be faith as you will need to have a reason backed up by evidence and logic to understand what faith demands.

According to this you will value nothing and that is impossible.

Gary David Currie

If I may be blunt one of the qualities I value in myself is that I realize I can be wrong on anything. I am more than willing to learn and grow but as I have said before my bullshit detector is fairly accurate and we need to stop focusing on the lies we continually tell ourselves as this is the main problem as I see it.

I don’t want you to wake up I just want you to stop lying to yourself.

Seek the truth always

Gary David Currie

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Who Hijacked Reality / #463 Demons and Delusions.

Monday, June 6th, 2011

 

 

Journal Entry #463

June 6th, 2011

There is nothing like reality to demonstrate how delusional people can be. Often I will have a conversation with believers and things are going well at first. We talk about concepts of truth and reality and when it is applied to the rest of their life they understand and agree but then when we come to their belief in their god it always takes a turn back into the delusion. Why is this, because reality and fantasy just don’t mix.

This conversation is a great example of how the delusion controls the thinking, how the desires corrupt reality.

Conversation;

Gary David Currie …………….Wow don’t you just love delusional thinking. Once down the path the pit stops are hard to see.

THEY JUST DON’T LISTEN…..

“I fear the man who believes he has arrived for the destination always changes.” Gary David Currie

Gary David Currie ………….I hope you understand that admitting you might be wrong leads to an open -mind and is the beginning of actually finding the truth..

Christian…………. I love truth whatever it is.

Gary David Currie………. Excellent so now the next step is to agree on the method for determining what is true and use this method on all things. I to love truth as well no matter what it is as I really don’t have a choice even if I think I do.

Christian…………That´s a good to start with. Can we agree that truth is holy?

Gary David Currie ………………No I would not agree to that. Maybe we can start off with the dictionary definition. I will then tell you mine and you yours and we can go from there. Saying truth is holy makes no sense as it only addresses a certain truth all truth. What I need from you to start with is a definition of truth backed up with a method of determining truth that works on all things as this is the foundation to determine truth. All truths. We can even leave religion out of this because if you bring it in then it will have to work on all things not religious.

Christian…….. Ok I agree.

Gary David Currie…………. So give me your definition and your method..

Christian…………..Can we agree that truth is not subjective but same for all people.

Gary David Currie……….. Yes it is the same as there are infinite truths. The definition of truth will not change. Here is mine since you have not offered yours.

Truth is all that is , all that is real.. now show me what method you use to determine truth in all matters, or things in life.

Christian…………Truth is all that is and all that is real. So next definition is what is real? Is it only what we can grasp with our senses or is there something that is true but we don’t know it or can see it?

Christian…………The next interesting question is, IS everything scientifically proved TRUTH?

Gary David Currie ……………you are correct there may be and are probably many things that are real that we have not confirmed as of this point and yes all we have is our sense to verify. But we cannot say something is true until we can verify it

Christian……Is there anything you can think of that is true but is impossible to prove?

Gary David Currie……… yes everything is scientifically proved truth at this point because we really have no other method of verification. Science and reason is the best method. if there is a better method that works on all things I will use it as I only seek what is true.

Christian…………What scientifically is “truth at this point” can change later and be proved to be lie by same method ??

Gary David Currie ……………No because we have no way of saying it is true until we can verify it. we may want it to be true but that is irrelevant. Also and this is very important we must include what we have already verified as true in the process even though at some point it may be proven wrong. The problem is that people take something as true and run with it that has not been verified. For example alien abductions or ancient aliens. Ghosts are another example.

Christian………….I agree. It is not true at this point, even though it is possible. OK.

Gary David Currie………….. I agree it can change but until it does we would be stupid to not follow it as this is what we know at this point. That is what science is all about. Science doesn’t know everything or else it would stop. All science is, is a method we use to determine truth by testing things through various methods to see if they can be proven to not be true.

Gary David Currie ……Now here is the problem if you are referring to gods of man. They may be possible but highly improbable as the evidence to disprove all the evidence to prove god is sound so why still believe in something that is probably not true? Because you want it to be. I appreciate you honesty and willingness to be open-minded at this point I am actually very impressed. I am in no way trying to change your mind that is your choice just talking about truth and how we determine it. This is what I use as a method on all things.

Christian…………I ask again, Is there anything you can think of that is true but is impossible to prove? Something like psychology and feelings, or inner conviction about something, like there must be soothing beyond what we can see or beyond universe and our knowledge.

Gary David Currie……….. Why must there be something is my question? Because we want there to. We can speculate forever on this but what is the point until we can prove it.

We have evidence for feelings that is testable, psychology is a field of science and we have… methods to test things. If there is something we will not find it for a very long time I will speculate so why think there is something there when so much evidence that can be verified says there may not be. Do people worship Dark matter or dark energy?

Christian………….My belief is based on an inner conviction that there is a reality beyond our current comprehension. It is because I felt, or if you want to believe I have experienced this reality as I perceived as more real than this I am in now. There was… a brief moment in my life that was not repeated after that, but it left an impression that made me unable to forget that there was something beyond this reality. This life feels like a illusion In comparison to what I saw and felt. I am aware that everything can also have another explanation, but it made a change in my attitude to life that I cannot change. (Maybe you think I am crazy or disturbed but I am considered as normal and I function as a normal person in all aspects) What I want to say is that I am convinced that there is an parallel reality that I call spiritual reality. I also know that I can never prove anything of it.

Christian………Beyond the words in the Bible I can see this reality. Nothing else but the Bible contains this knowledge I have experienced. Believe me I have also read a lot of books. I have two university degrees, and I have read lot of philosophy and psychology.

Gary David Currie…. ..I have no way of disproving your personal experience nor would I want to. But you have said the important part that you have no way of verifying it. Now I am sure that you understand that there can only be one answer to our origins and to all questions that is going to be true so if all the evidence points away from what you have experienced I don’t understand why you or anyone would accept what is probably not true. This makes no sense to me. I have had personal experiences as well but I do not take that leap into the unknown as true. Here is my problem you have taken you experience and then jumped to all sorts of conclusions. I base this on what you say. You of course realize and again I appreciate your honesty that there is probably another answer besides what you say or see.

Gary David Currie ……..You research is bias from your experience it seems. Spiritual reality has no evidence that can be tested so what you are doing since you have studied philosophy is participating in what is called the argument from ignorance. I say this no…t to insult but out of respect for your acquired knowledge. Step outside your experience and try to disprove it to validate it then we can say there is a basis for your hypothesis but at this point there is not. Reality simply does not work the way you say it does even though it might what we know tells is that is does not.

HERE IS WHERE THE COVERSATION BROKE DOWN…………….

Christian…….Yes you are right, it is not “that” reality like your definition, it is as I said to you a spiritual reality and it is very real for me. Because I have as I call it “Spiritual eyes” I know it is true because it manifests in the same reality you know. It is connected, but not connected in a way you or anyone can figure out. I will give you an example: If you go around and hate most people and complain on most others, it seems for you like it is right to do because you believe it is true what you say, see and think about them. They are bad people. So even if you are right, you will not accomplish anything with that kind of behaviour. What will happened is that you will be depressed, alone, odd, sick, maybe hate by others and similar. This kind of behaviour will even have physical manifestation in your body or around you. This I know is true but no one can prove it will be like that and exactly how it will be in each case. So a specific behaviour will end up in a range of consequences no one knows exactly how but it IS TRUE AND IT WILL NOT BE GOOD. This is just one example of how something can be truth without being possible to prove ever. Another example is. SIN will lead to destruction, I mean who can prove this, “NO ONE” but it is still truth. How do I know? Not because I have read it in the Bible but because I have experienced this under my entire life. And I JUST KNOW, it is TRUTH even if I cannot prove it.

Gary David Currie……… I am sorry but I must be honest with you and tell you that this makes absolutely no sense. If something does not have evidence to take it as true is called the argument from ignorance. I understand your reasoning. You cannot create a new definition of reality and then say it is true.

if we follow this through I must be strong on this point then anything can be true, anything someone feels is true they say can be true. All religions will then be true. All beliefs will be true and this simply is not true. It does not make sense to just feel it or know it because you feel you have experienced it. Let me say that If I say that my experience is the opposite of yours can you dispute my experience? No so we can’t both be right correct? That is why we use credible evidence because personal experience and witnesses are not reliable as forms of evidence. You may be right but all it will be is a guess that has no support and that is a terrible reason to believe something as true.

This is not an example of something being true that can never be proven as all things can eventually be proven or else they are not true.

Again I say this is the argument from ignorance and it is beyond me how intelligent people just go but their gut on things without getting further proof. Your choice though but it probably is not true and if you value what is true you will see this if not you value what you want to be true. Again no offence this is what is true.

You are not acknowledging what we do know; you have ignored all of this in favour of want you feel. So if you are right then I am wrong, the vast majority of scientists are wrong and all the evidence that disputes what you say is wrong. Your experience counts for more than all of this. That makes no sense..

Christian…………Well Gary when you say “no offence this is what is true.” it is to me Pride. Now you claim to know the truth. NO one knows the truth but God “IF he exists” And yes if I am right then all of you are wrong, that is true. Does this make sense .. ?

Gary David Currie ……….No because all the verifiable evidence does not support what you say if it did I would accept is as true. I think you are missing the reasoning behind what I am saying. Why are you right and all other religions wrong if they use the same method , experience that you say is valid. Again this makes no sense. Do you understand what the argument from ignorance is? And yes we do know the truth on many things..

Christian…………Argument from ignorance is what all do including you and scientists.

Christian……yes we do know the truth on many things, but some know more than others

Gary David Currie……….. No wrong again sorry.. The argument from ignorance states that unless you can prove something is not true to me 100% which is impossible I will believe what I want to believe even though it can be proven with a high degree of probability to not be true. What I do and what science does is say I don’t know when we don’t know and not accept it as true especially if there is plenty of evidence to say it is probably not true.

Gary David Currie……….. Knowing more than others will not change the truth on something. You and others ignore so much to fulfill your beliefs. Jana if what you believed had any supporting evidence I would believe it. Again tell me why you don’t believe all others who make similar claims but different gods because there is no evidence that you will accept correct? Now apply that to your god from my perspective and it will be the same conclusion. Why is your experience valid and mine not?

Gary David Currie…………… So why is your inner conviction right and mine or that of others wrong. What basis do you use to refute all others but yours?

Christian……….Because we agreed that there is only ONE truth, and IF my is correct then all of yours is wrong, incorrect. My truth also tells me through the Bible which IS breath of the God by my experience, about all of you and I see how deception works through all of you and then I mean ALL religions including religion Christianity and “religion” Atheism. (For me it is just belief)

Gary David Currie……… Ok but your still missing the huge point.. Knowing what is true is based on a method of discovery and humanities method is verifiable evidence. You use evidence just as much as the next person but your evidence in the case of your god is not verifiable and that is the important part. I will say this again you are just guessing which is what we all do but the idea is to make the best guess we can and that is why we base it on verifiable evidence. Have you put your beliefs to the teat of actually trying to disprove them? This will be the true test.

You think I am all about atheism and I am not I am an atheist by default by seeking what is true not an atheist first. You have put your beliefs before the truth because in all honesty they will not stand up to verification so really you believe solely based on the idea of your desires from the benefits of your belief. My belief is that I find truth.

Gary David Currie……… This whole idea of deception is just silly. Why would I be trying to deceive you? What is my purpose in doing this? That is old barbaric thinking based on control systems from 100′s of years ago. I must admit it really is silly in this day in age to think that there are people who are of the devil who are trying to deceive you into not believing in your god, It is actually paranoid thinking. Think about the time the bible was written in and why it would be beneficial to have this in the bible.

Believe in god if you want to but this silly deception stuff is just out of place in this modern world. This is just another example of why the bible and the beliefs it promotes are of man from 2,000 years ago and have no place in a realistic modern world.

We were actually having a good conversation about ideals and concepts. I was impressed with your willingness to be open so why did you go and bring it to things that just are ridiculous in the real world we live in. Do you really believe in devils and demons? Do you realize the implications behind this belief? Where do they come from? What realm do they exist in? How do they cross over? If they can cross over then why can’t we see evidence of this alternate existence? Why doesn’t god just get rid of them? Are they more powerful than god? If they are then god is not god. Why are they involved in the human world? Do they just run around all day deceiving humans? What is the point? Why have bad spirits and good spirits?

Can you not see the can of worms you have opened here?

Christian ….Lot of questions but there is an answer to each of them.

Gary David Currie ………..We are back to the style from before. I am not doing any of those things. I just speak from an honest realistic position. We were talking about truth but the problem is that you ignored certain things when they contradicted your belief instead of being open-minded all the way through. I told you I am not trying to change your mind I am just talking.

Gary David Currie …………….Well let’s hear the answers to each one of them with proof to back it up otherwise you will just be making it up.

Christian………. Actually a good questions we can take one at a time on my wall. It is deep questions.

Gary David Currie……….. I do understand I just don’t agree and that is the difference between you and me I have taken the time to understand what I refute. You say you have read all these philosophy books but Almost all of them will dispute god, Have you read Hume or Kant?

Christian…………yes

Gary David Currie………… How about you go back and answer all of the questions I asked before that you ignored first. You still have not answered the most important one and that is what method do you use to determine truth?

Christian………All of those men where just neurotics. Most of them where Demon lead or demon possessed.

Gary David Currie………… And still after all these philosophers you still accept something that cannot be proven as true? You still think that the bible is written by god and not man? You still believe in demons? Are you aware of existentialism? Have you explored all ideas on god? Have you studies evolution?

Gary David Currie…………………. I guess we are done if you belie in demons You have moved into an area I am not willing to follow as it is just plain silly? Really demons come on that is ridiculous and you can’t be serious?

Christian……..There is no method to determine truth. Truth is Jesus Christ and all these men you are talking about, how can they make a method to determine anything about God. That is silly. They are just mere men.

Christian…………You don´t know what demons are, you think it is Hollywood bogyman. That is ridiculous, so you are deceived to not see the true evil inside the people.

Christian………You actually don´t have to have the spiritual eyes to see demon influence on people. You will see that, that is one thing I can promise you.

Gary David Currie …………….Yes there is and it is called science. Ok Jana you are lost then in the delusion. You cannot mix reality with insanity. What else can I say you have jumped off the deep end and then you wonder why people ridicule you as you say? I am done it was interesting for awhile but now it is not . I do not jump into the delusion with those who are inside it. Enjoy.. You showed moments of sanity. Perhaps we will talk again someday when you can stay in reality a little longer.

Christian……………… You are lost then in the delusion, you don´t see obvious things around you. You need proof for everything. Do you need a proof that you exist?

Gary David Currie…….. yes don’t you?

Christian…………….It is not polite to call people crazy even if They were, especially if they were, and if I am insane with two university degrees What makes it you and lot of others without education at all? That is lack of love, what is the point of seeking the truth when you lack the love. What will you do with your truth?

Christian………….. I know very much about science, more than you think. I am just talking to you in hope of opening your eyes to something greater than you can see now.

Gary David Currie……………. And that is you problem the idea that you feel you will open my eyes and that you are right whereas I am just talking with no expectation of opening your eyes as only you can do that. You know Jana you have never asked me about my experiences in religion, what I believe and why. Have you tried to understand what I present and why without bias? Personally I think you are so busy trying to show me how right you are that it will not allow you to understand my perspective. You have no idea what I have seen or ho I really am and I have no intention of sharing my personal life on the internet and that is why I talk about concepts and ideals. If you really knew about science I think I would have seen some of it in our discussions. Those who truly understand science don’t generally believe in gods or anything else unproven.

I hope you enjoyed the conversation and keep your eyes open for demons.

Seek the truth always

Gary David Currie

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Who Hijacked Reality / #455 Our survival instinct is so strong….

Saturday, May 28th, 2011

 

Journal Entry #455

May 28th, 2011

Our survival instinct is so ingrained in us that once we realized that we are going to die and what that means we created a way to believe that we could survive beyond this.

Look at everything we do on a daily basis it really is about survival, about existing and all else flows from this. I have used Maslow’s hierarchy of needs before as an example as it perfectly illustrates and explains why we do what we do but I will say that it does not happen in an orderly fashion such as demonstrated in the chart. It is the self realization, our awareness that we are alive that we exist that drive us. This is what separates’ us from all other species on this planet, our ability to see beyond the moment.

We want to live beyond what we think is our mortal life so we have created all these elaborate delusions to extend this life. Now there is of course no credible evidence for any of this but humanities history is rich and diverse along this pattern. We now know better and yet we still carry on in this self deception.

Besides our need to survive daily with the necessities it seems we fell this need to be valued, to feel important not only to ourselves but also to others whom we surround ourselves with. Again this will only be valued in this one and only life so why do we spend so much time fooling ourselves that there is a life beyond? Not a only a life but we have decided that this life is so fantastic that we have created so many other delusions to support the main delusion. Once we buy into the nonsense then the games begin and what games they are as we have made them so elaborate with so many rules that we end up killing each other over them.

Also during this existence we have realized there is what we call reality but reality does not fulfill the desires that we truly want. It only hinders them  by telling us that this is probably the one and only life we will get so what do we do, we ignore reality by pretending that it does not exist. Well it does whether you like it or not.

Doesn’t matter what I say or do it will not change reality, you will not live forever so suck it up butter cup and get on with what is actually true. It really is the same message over and over I promote but I just try to say it in as many ways as possible hoping that something will click in the minds of people. It seems like a futile effort at times as the delusion is powerful the fantasy is hypnotizing but at the end of all the mystery it really is not true, there are no gods or anything else that we have created to fulfill this desire to survive beyond this life.

Why do I continually promote the idea that god is not real? Besides than fact that it is the truth and I value the truth this life we have can be so much better for all by accepting reality and working towards a positive existence for all. The time and effort both physically and mentally that is exhausted in keeping these delusions alive is staggering and futile. The web of lies that has been created from this survival instinct must be exposed and accepted for what it really is. We are so caught up in this deception that most cannot see that it even might be a deception. If there really is an afterlife do you not think that someone would have been able to get a clear message back to us somehow to let us know it is real?

There are so many other ways to fill the needs we have, to feel important without fooling ourselves. If you truly look at the method we have chosen to feel important such as religion you will actually see it makes us feel less important than more important. The harm that is caused far outweighs the benefits so use a little common sense here and realize that reality dictates things in a certain way even though it may not be what you want. I am sure you will find some way to see that you can benefit from reality by accepting it more than you can by denying it.

This is the one and only life, this is the only moment and all else is delusional thinking so embrace this moment, embrace this life and let’s get on with the business of survival that can be more pleasant than miserable. It really is a choice and we need to stop choosing the delusion.

Seek the truth always

Gary David Currie

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